When Data Tells a Story: Journalism, Risk, and the Future of Information with Nick Elliott, WSJ

In this episode of Coding Conversations, STEM Educational Institute Founder and President Nikisha Alcindor sits down with Nick Elliott, Vice President and Head of Communities at Dow Jones Risk and Chair of the Wall Street Journal (WSJ) Chief Compliance Officer Council, for a timely conversation about data, journalism, trust, and decision-making in today’s information-driven world. With a career spanning The Wall Street Journal and Dow Jones as a journalist, moderator, editorial leader, and content innovator, Nick brings deep insight into how professional audiences make sense of complex information in the age of AI across business, finance, risk, compliance, and cybersecurity.

Transcript

Welcome And Guest Introduction

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 0:10

Welcome to another episode of Coding Conversations, created and produced by the STEM Educational Institute. I'm Nikisha Alcinder, president and founder of the STEM Educational Institute, where we provide free programming in STEM, financial literacy, and mental health to high school students. High school students go through one-year program, and at the end they're provided with a college scholarship. Coding Conversations is our way of bringing to you, the people, information about careers in STEM financial literacy, as well as bringing up very important topics that are facing our community. Today we have a wonderful conversation about journalism. Not just about journalism, but also about how do we trust what we see and how do we use data. And to help us with that conversation is Nick Elliott. Nick Elliott is vice president and head of communities at Dow Jones Risk and chair of the Wall Street Journal Chief Compliance Officer Council. In this role, he convenes risk and compliance professionals at events around the world to foster discussions about navigating the business environment. Throughout his career, he has focused on serving the information needs of professional audience, both in the corporate and financial markets. Previously, he was the founding editor of the Wall Street Journal Risk and Compliance, which became a must-read in that market and launched events covering risk and compliance, sustainability and cybersecurity. Welcome, Nick. Hi, Nakacia. Thanks for inviting me on. It's such a pleasure to have you. I should also mention that Nick holds a degree in economics from the University of York in the UK.

From Cricket Dreams To Journalism

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 1:51

So, Nick, you're here in New York, and I have to I have to ask, how did this all start? Did you always want to be a journalist or where did it where did this come from?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 2:02

No, when I was a when I was a kid, I wanted to be a professional cricketer.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 2:06

Oh, okay.

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 2:08

But I realized pretty quickly, uh had I had the shocking realization that I just I didn't have the enough talent for that.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 2:14

Okay.

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 2:15

Um but I got interested in journalism when I was at university, at college. I I discovered I liked writing, and I was also interested in the world around me and business and finance in particular, so it was sort of a natural pairing.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 2:28

Okay.

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 2:29

And that's been the last 35 years. Um I think the other the other thing I would mention, this is uh perhaps going a little deeper into the way that my mind works. I I grew up in a suburb of London, a fairly quiet place, and I always felt like I was on the edge of this great city with a whole lot more going on in the middle of it, and I wanted to get more of a ringside seat. I wanted to be close to things going on in the world, and journalism has certainly provided that. I've had that ringside seat over the last 35 years. I've uh I've covered a whole lot of different markets and businesses. I've done events around the world, I've talked to a whole lot of interesting, smart, and influential people. So it's it's been it's been great.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 3:18

I I love that. What I love also about kind of wanting to be in the center of what's going on is the fact that you were econ major, right?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 3:28

Yeah.

Why Data Needs Context In 2026

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 3:29

And I'm wondering, like with that background coupled with all of this data that's out there, can you talk about how data without context, right? You're at the center of everything, can be dangerous or kind of helpful.

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 3:47

Yeah, sure. So I think there are there are three big trends here that will help me in answering the question. Um one is that the world is more turbulent than it has been in many years. So if you look if you just look at 2026, we've got the Iran War going on. We've had the leader of Venezuela seized and now held in a US prison. We had a diplomatic standoff over Greenland, and we've got all the disruption coming with artificial intelligence and companies grappling with that. And you really have to you really have to put all that together, I think. Um I think there's also an irony here in that there's been a lot of discussion about the retreat from globalization or deglobalization, but in a way, world events are more linked together than ever before. And we feel we feel the tremors of those. So I think you need to understand the bigger picture and how it all fits together. So if all you're doing is is looking at the data, that's that's not going to give you that. So that's that's one thing. The other thing, the other two things, one is that people's consumption habits have changed so much over time. We're all bombarded with information. We tend to consume it more superficially than we have in the past. And that that in itself can be quite dangerous or misleading. And and then the third thing is uh the development of deepfakes powered by AI. So can we even trust the underlying information that's out there in the first place? So all of this you really increasingly need to have multiple sources to understand what's actually going on and to have a fact base.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 5:29

Mm-hmm. I love that. I was at kind of a press, a broadcast conference years ago, and one of the head of the major of a major studio said, you know, one thing I'm confident about is that people only have two eyes, right? And with that, that's how I look at how we're gonna beat our competition. So given that we have two eyes, all of this information is coming out of uh at us, we see charts, we see all these things. What is the first question someone should ask themselves to kind of then deduce, okay, the the point is proven. I I get this, and they've proven what they've shown to me based on this information.

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 6:09

Yeah, I think that comes back to establishing some trust in the sources of information that you're using. So we all consume multiple sources, but which are the ones that you think are reliable, and you can often only judge that over time. And then why? You have to come to your own decision about why you think that's a trustworthy source. And once you have that, then you're in a much better place, I think, to make those sorts of decisions about saying, okay, I I now I understand, I think this is this is factual.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 6:40

What I think is so interesting when you think about trust and reporting at the news, one of the simplest things that I go back to is the weather, right? When you think about in New York, when someone says it's gonna snow, right? Immediately everywhere there's like a huge snowstorm. You don't even have to hear anything. Most people, some people believe it, some people don't. And so when you think about it, it's like, well, who are they trusting? And at what point do you because you deduce, you're seeing kind of the weather, how is it going? And then you're like, okay, it's it's going to snow or it's not going to snow. There are nacks, you see trucks going out, you see people preparing. And so I'm wondering, in your experience, like when you're you're getting all this information, probably things faster than we get it, how do you then deduce how you're trusting your sources? Like how how do you come to that internal trust so that you can then push out the news?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 7:41

Yeah, a lot of it comes down to uh knowing who would actually know. So when you're in business and financial journalism, a lot a lot of the questions you'll get from editors when you're writing an article are, okay, this person says this, but how do they know it? Um and and then there's the pattern over time. Is this a source that seems to have a an orientation to an honest uh attempt to ascertain the facts? And and then over time that's gonna give you more trust as you as you rely on that source. So those are the kinds of decisions that I think are actually gonna be increasingly important. You know, we're gonna have I mean we're already sort of in the early stages of a of a bombardment of deep fake information. And so people really, I think if if they're interested in discovering the facts, they're gonna need to go a layer deeper to determine that.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 8:36

Yeah, and it's interesting because like, you know, they say a picture is worth a thousand words, and we know that pictures and things that people see can actually lead to to action. People can riot, they can protest based on a picture. What how do you detect deep fakes or what are what are some things that consumers or individuals should think about as they're consuming and looking at information?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 9:01

Yeah, so um I think you need to look at the pattern of of information over time. That's that's one thing. Does it does it fit with the general trend? Does it does this raise any red flags for me? Is it an outlier? Um The source, of course, as we've talked about, where is it coming from and how do they how do they how do they know that information that they're reporting? Um and um and then and then the judgment that you should really try and develop over time. You know, I I think um if if people really are interested in in finding out the facts, then they should they should develop their own methods for doing that, and that comes comes down to developing the judgment and and and having a certain amount of skepticism about what they're hearing as well.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 9:44

Well, it's so interesting because there's a before social media and everything, it was always like breaking news, right?

Speed Versus Accuracy In News

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 9:53

And you saw the thing go across the screen. But now it seems like it seems like someone with their cell phone is breaking news and posting it on YouTube. Like how do you balance making sure something is factual versus reporting it first?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 10:10

Yeah, well, having been inside the uh newsrooms of Dow Jones and and the Wall Street Journal, there's a lot of attention paid to that. And speed is important, of course. You don't you don't want to be behind on something, but it's in some ways even more important to be accurate because if you get it wrong, it's uh there can be real repercussions, not just for you as an organization, but also to the outside world. So um it comes back to the way that the news organization gathers its information and then checks it. That's that's really important. And that's why you you want to rely on sources that have high standards because they have that built into the into their news get news gathering operation. It's not it's not just um uh uh thoughtlessly put out and and published and and left for people to decide for themselves. We're acting as a filter. Sure. You know, that's why that's why people rely on brands like the ones that we have.

Inside Dow Jones Brands And Vetting

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 11:09

So just so folks know, I want to make sure we talk about all the brands because Dow Jones is not just the Wall Street Journal. We have to we should we should clarify that. But I I want you to clarify that. And I also want you to take us through the process of what does vetting or information look like in your seat, or what has it looked like? So um can you tell us all of the news outlets that Dow Jones has?

Speaker 1 11:34

Certainly, yeah. So Dow Jones is an old company, it goes back to the 1880s, it started out uh providing tear sheets, literal physical tear sheets on stock prices. That's why it was called the Wall Street Journal. It was a it was started by um Charles Dow and Edward Jones. They um they saw an opportunity, and then from that they launched the Wall Street Journal a few years later. Uh so that's it's really the flagship of the company, but the company has uh does a lot more than that as well. Um we have um several main businesses. One is in financial and business information. So some of the familiar brands there are Dow Jones Newswires, Market Watch, Investors Business Daily, Barron's. We have and big energy business now, previously called Opus. This was a business we acquired not that long ago. It does all kinds of energy information from prices to reporting to analysis. Um and then there's the risk business, which I work in, which is provides a broad range of risk information. Uh we have our own journalists, we do a lot of a lot of analysis, but we've broadened out the areas we cover as well. Um Geopolitics has become so much more important that last year we acquired two geopolitical analysis companies. Um this matches up with the way that companies are seeing the world. Yes. They can't just focus on a handful of risks. Now they have then they need this broad picture, and that's what we're trying to provide them with.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 13:11

I love that. And so as we uh within the when you're looking at, let's say, for example, the asset management sector, different fund managers, and they're trying to assess risk, right? How do you, as you're you're getting all this data, what does that look like? You you know, obviously you have people, but how do they ascertain whether or not the data is ready to go, if it is truly a risk? What does that look like?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 13:38

Yeah, well for them, it's it's they rely on us and we have to we have to keep high standards in the data that we gather. And this is especially important in the risk area because companies are making real decisions about whether to do business with other people or organizations, and if they get it wrong, they can suffer a large fine. Yes. You know, this this happened over a period of period of years. So for us, we have a big team of researchers actually looking into all that data. They have language skills so that they can make sure that somebody who's on a forbidden list is correctly translated and they sh and they match up with another list. Um that really nothing should fall through the cracks. Uh but there's but it's also a case of sometimes less is more. Um we we because we want everything to be high quality, we we limit the data set so that um whatever they're relying on us for, they can count on, and they're not getting what are called false positives, which is entities, companies, or individuals that they don't really need in the data in the first place.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 14:53

You know, it's so interesting because one of the things I find interesting with just journalism in general is you have kind of two sectors of the population, those uh in New York that read like the Daily News, the New York Post, uh those kind of magazines, and then you have the magazines, sorry, uh newspapers, and then you have Wall Street Journal, New York Times, and those kind of data sources, right? I'm wondering like when you're and they're two audience, different audiences, right? You serve a more business economic audience, but what you're reporting is actually extremely important to individuals who aren't in the business world. How does someone, when they hear an economic data point, um, kind of could kind of translate that for themselves, right? Um and so I'm like, yeah, how do how how would you recommend someone who who who's not in the business world, but you're reporting, they're hearing things, there's all this misinformation, YouTube is like the biggest, there's so much out there, people are afraid of like all of these things with cybersecurity and AI. How how should one look at that if they don't have the knowledge? What's the and you could tell me resources as well that people should use?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 16:11

Well, actually, it's been a big push at the journal to be more explanatory over a period of time. And I think you'll find that in some of the other articles that we put out there. Um, I guess I guess the first thing is to understand that a lot of this will have an impact on you as an individual, even if you're even if you don't work in the business world. Uh and many things will come back to you and affect you in your in your own budget or in your life generally. Um But then um I think I think it's really healthy to to build up a knowledge of what's going on in on in the world and how how that can affect you and hence what it means generally.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 16:51

You know, it's interesting that you say that because in our program we use Market Watch and our students build mock portfolios and they invest. And for anyone who's out there, you can go to Market Watch, you can create a game, you can play with a game a game, quote unquote, and build a portfolio of stocks and just kind of see how your investments would do. And we I do that because we want to make sure, to your point, that students are understanding how things are invested. Um and so one of the things that I find is that in the material that you provide, it is very does have a lot of explanation for students and for individuals. And I'm wondering, have you guys thought about how do you how do you know if it's working or not? I'm sure you have numbers. How do you know if people are understanding what you're putting it, putting out and taking it, making it how you know that it's relevant, that they feel like it's relevant?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 17:50

Yeah, well the the media industry is i is is in constant revolution, and it has been for years. Um our organization in particular, I think probably all media organizations pay a lot of attention now to to who's consuming their information, how far into an article they're going, um whether they move from one article to another. There's a lot of tracking of engagement because it's it's so essential. Um so I think that's that's where the journal or Dow Jones would look. That's how they would see whether the information they're putting out is resonating with the audiences they're trying to reach.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 18:33

And I'm sure that kind of tells you whether or not people are trusting you, right? If you if people are I mean, I'm just saying that, but tell me if that's true or not, right? Is that does that help engender trust if you're seeing people are reading more, or how do you determine if people are trusting your resources more?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 18:50

That's that's one measure. There's an annual survey that's that's done of the most trusted media sources in North America. The Wall Street Journal always comes out top, trusted by those who who lean right, trusted by those who lean left. But um sorry, I lost my train. Yeah, that's okay.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 19:11

Yeah. You know, it's it's interesting because at some point it becomes what do you what do you read? And there, as you know, there's the above the fold. And I was I always go back and forth with the Wall Street Journal because there is there's so many, is it the Sunday paper? You get like all these different inserts, you get like a Oh, this is the physical newspaper.

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 19:34

The physical newspaper, right? Long since moved to the app.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 19:36

He's moved to the app. I'm still in the paper. Okay. So but I like the paper because sometimes it just gets me oriented. Like the app sometimes is kind of um it's it's difficult for me to navigate. And that's just me. And so how do you kind of do you use visuals to make things and separate things so that a reader can say this is useful data and this isn't? Or you know, how do you guys kind of manage that?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 20:04

Yeah, well, this this this is the other big trend in media generally, including at the journal, is the the effort to tell stories in ways other than text. So you'll find a lot more graphics data, you'll find a lot more video in their podcasts. You know, we have we have lots of good podcasts that go out. Um it's a reflection of the fact that people have become people consume information in different ways. You know, my my son gets everything via video. That's the way he likes to consume things. I'm still very text-based. It's how I've grown up in my consumption habits. So you really got you really got to provide it to people in every way that they want to receive it.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 20:43

Do you think that journalists that are coming up through journalism schools and new journalists are how are they learning how to kind of gather data and use that in their storytelling?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 20:56

I think they're probably in a great position to do it, you know, because it's it's um it's much more much more important and much more prevalent than it used to be. Like um, you know, when I started out as a reporter, uh most of what we did was text. We were we were looking at data and writing articles around the data, but um the data was considered kind of separate in a way. Now it's much more intrinsic. And now there's a lot more data, there's a lot more uh many interesting articles to be written based on data or with data to support them. And the tools are there also to analyze the data.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 21:35

You know, it's interesting because one of the things that I've I've observed just in life is that sometimes the data, the interpretation of the data isn't correct either. Right?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 21:47

Yeah.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 21:48

Right? So how do you manage that? Because you can look at data and be like and come to XYZ conclusion. Um what does that look like for in your in your seat?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 21:59

Yeah, well I think I think there's a number of things you can do. One is, of course, the source and is it is it reliable? But also what is it really showing you? Does it actually show what it purports to show? Bucketing them all together.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 22:22

Sure.

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 22:28

So it just calls, I think, for for really looking at what's in front of you and does it show what it's supposed to show? Is there something missing here? And what's the original source?

How Risk Data Drives Decisions

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 22:41

And now given that you're working with business leaders, many business leaders take your information and action on it, right? They they kind of So what does Tell me what that looks like in terms of what does that look like? How how are you seeing business leaders? Obviously there's a lot, but just give me an example of how you see the information that you guys are providing being used.

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 23:03

So if you think about the different layers in a company, you have the people at the top, the C-suite, and they're looking for analysis or thought-provoking articles that they can use to understand the world around them, but also probably to have discussions within their own company. And this is what we strive to provide them with. So ideally we're doing something for them that they can take back and they can they can bring it up with the CEO or somebody else senior and it and it has some influence on the strategy of the company. But then we also provide a lot of information for people further down in the company as well who need more practical, they have more practical uses of data. For example, they might be screening the partners that they have that they're doing business with, because they want to understand the risk that there is in those partners. It's a big issue in business at the moment, third parties. So we try and provide information that is useful at all different levels of a company.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 24:09

And so kind of following on than that, there's there's a in finance at least in many customer, there's there's a requirement for know your client, right?

Know Your Customer And Sanctions Screening

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 24:19

Um KYC. How are you are you are businesses using that information in KYC? Because there are companies that do it, but are you guys in that getting into that field as well?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 24:29

We are, yeah, we are very much in that field in all the big risk areas that companies face. So things like money laundering or bribery, we we help companies screen for that and limit their risk.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 24:40

So tell me how does that work? Because I know having dealt with other entities that do KYCs, and for the audience members that don't know what that is, so normally if you are an investment bank or a business and you you are in the business of holding clients that are let that are long-term long-term hold, whether you're doing an MA transaction or they're going to be a client of the firm, there's a requirement that is called a KYC, know your client. Within that, it has a bunch of different buckets that goes into money laundering, a bunch of things, kind of like a very deep background check. And some companies have different ways of doing it. And so I'm wondering if you can walk us through what does that look like on your for you guys at the WA.

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 25:30

Yeah, so we are we are fortunate in that we have a huge database of publications, not just our own, but we have we have uh a database that we've curated over about 50 years with 33,000 different publications in it. They're all it's all licensed information, they're all vetted, so they're all reliable sources, everything from newspapers in Africa to academic journals. From that, we distill that down to a list of uh companies and individuals, and then we match that up against what governments are putting out where they're saying, here's a list of um, for example, here's a list of might be Chinese companies that we don't think American companies should be doing business with because they're involved in providing weaponry to Russia. That would be one example. So we match up the two. We match those official lists against their own lists, and then it's up to the companies themselves as to how much risk they want to take on. You know, some will they'll all set their own risk comfort levels, and they'll then match that against our lists, and they'll decide, okay, we have to do business in this particular region, we're gonna be very careful, but we're gonna we're gonna do business with these companies. Or they might say, okay, this whole we're gonna we're gonna be out of this whole region, and we'll use the Dow Jones list to just block out all of those companies and individuals.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 26:57

So what does that look like? Is it a in terms of the product, like what does the end user get? Is it a data like how does that work?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 27:04

They can get it in two different ways. It can be a feed, which they plug into their own interface and then they use our data with their own tools that they've developed, or it can be a um what you'd call a front-end product where it's our own platform and then they use our tools to manipulate the data in there.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 27:21

So how does one assess whether or not or how do you guys assess whether or not the data that you have is accurate, right? I'm just w and I'm wondering if you're probably using some AI tools in there now.

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 27:35

I'm just we are we are using AI tools to help organize the data, certainly. Aaron Ross Powell But we start from that basis of having all these reliable sources.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 27:46

Okay.

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 27:47

And where companies often get into trouble is uh they will um they will ha they will try and screen, but they'll miss things out. Often it comes back to language, so that's one of our skills uh where we can if you take an example like of Samu bin Laden, we make sure that his name was correctly translated across multiple languages so that uh if you were a bank that was trying to screen him out, you you wouldn't miss it because it's in different characters in a different language, for example.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 28:17

Now, do you have a way because there are a lot of videos on YouTube that are with foreign individuals speaking, right? And then you have like a give like a translator that's over that, right? How does one how does one know if that's actually what they're saying, right?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 28:34

Yeah, that's that's not w we're not really in that space at the moment, the video side of things. But it's uh I'm sure it's gonna be really important as well. Right now we're we're mostly focused on written documents.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 28:47

Written documents. Yeah. Um because that kind of goes back to the deep fakes, the people are consuming things quicker, you know, a 15-second video to give a point, and especially the headlines, right? You'll see like a headline that says something, and then you're you have to decide, at least myself as a consumer, I don't know about you, when you get involved with get involved. I mean, when you start investing time and watching a YouTube, you have to decide like if you're gonna abandon it or keep watching, um, right? And so it's that trust again that happens there. Um and so obviously you've spoken to a lot of business leaders.

Deepfakes Cybersecurity And AI Defense

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 29:26

Um and when you're speaking to business leaders, what are some of the things that are on top of mind for them? Like what are what are the biggest risks? What and what keeps you up at night? I'm sure you have a a lot on your mind. So but I'll first answer the first one. For business leaders, what are you hearing? What are the concerns that you were hearing? Aaron Ross Powell, Jr.

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 29:45

Yeah, well, the the the big ones I think are geopolitical risk. And that touches on so many other things. It touches on supply chains, which are a huge risk. Uh they we discovered that we had supply chains during the pandemic when we were all running out of toilet paper and so on. You know, we've taken it for granted over a period of years this complex network of suppliers worldwide. Now it's become an issue for other reasons because of tariffs and uh changes of government and that kind of thing. So that would be a big one. AI would be another one, artificial intelligence. The biggest risk there for companies, according to what the companies themselves say, is being left behind by their competitors who could get to grips with it faster and then leave them behind. But there are also a lot of other risks associated with AI. So those those would be two of the big areas. But you you brought up deep fakes. I mean, that's definitely one that's building. We've seen an explosion of deep fake information. A lot of it is video-based, increasingly audio-based as well, where voices are being cloned. But I think there's also going to be a new wave of deep fake documents. And circling back to our the discussion we just had about know your customer, that's a real issue there. And actually, I was at a one of our conferences last week where a an attorney with one of the big law firms brought it up. They're starting to see it now, where there's fake documentary evidence that may mean that somebody comes into your supply chain who's actually banned on one of these government watch lists. So that's that's going to be a big area as well. Trevor Burrus, Jr.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 31:26

Mm-hmm. And so it sounds like, you know, if it's too good to be true, it probably is, right? When it's coming to business owners and looking at vendors that are coming into their system. Um so I'm wondering, how does one prov I guess the KYC would be but it seems like people are going deeper, right? I think we have to, yeah.

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 31:48

I mean we're gonna have to we're gonna need new forms of authentication. We've all we've all become accustomed to multi-factor authentication. Yes. You know, you sign onto a website, they send you they send you a text with a code, that kind of thing I think is gonna have to happen more widely.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 32:06

But does that really work? I feel like it doesn't because I have gotten so many small cards. Has anyone got those small cards in the mail that say that your your information has been stolen? Um and it it's from a company that is a derivative of s of like Delta. I got one for Delta, and it was it's just like, you know, love Delta, you know, I like spell miles. But like, what is that about? I mean, I don't know if you've experienced that as a consumer, or if you if that so it's like, is does is it really working, or is it compiling information about it that's being sold on the dark web? That's kind of what I feel. Like, is it more authentication?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 32:46

With cybersecurity, it's it's there's no there's never any grounds for complacency. And especially with AI tools becoming more readily available, it's sort of what happened with cybersecurity. You know, it used to be something that was done by fairly sophisticated actors. So the attacks were relatively few, but now you can go on the dark web and buy a ransomware package and overnight you you don't need any expertise. Overnight you can become a cyber criminal and you can start attacking organizations and locking down their data and demanding a ransom. So we saw this explosion in ransomware, but that's gonna be supercharged by artificial intelligence. It's just much more efficient. So on the defensive side, companies need to do similar things to keep up.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 33:31

What are some things that companies need to what are some things they need to be doing?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 33:37

So the well, there are AI tools, and I think that's gonna become the norm. They they need the AI tools to defend themselves as well. AI can consume much larger amounts of information and see patterns much more effectively, so it should be ideal for for cyber defense. Then there's something that's already taken hold, which is um where you layer your def your defenses. So it used to be the case with companies that if you got inside, that was it. You could run Riot, you could get into the human resources data, you could get into the technical data, whatever it was. Now I think most companies have have layers, they restrict access at different layers, so you kind of protect the crown jewels of the company.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 34:19

Now, do you find that most companies have the have the human capital that has the knowledge to actually do that? Because it seems like you guys are coming in and helping them. I mean, what is your I guess what is have you noticed, like are they ready or are you are you is it like danger when you're talking to some of these CEOs?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 34:44

I think we're we're all learning at the same time. Okay. But what is remarkable with me is how rapidly senior executives have come up to speed on AI. So even last year, I remember having a a conversation with a senior person about AI agents, which are these autonomous AI it's an autonomous form of AI that can do some of the work without human direction. Last week I led a discussion with a group of senior executives about what they're doing with AI agents, and it was way more sophisticated, and some of them are very far along with it. So it it's it's a difficult time, I think, because so much is changing in the world. But we're also I think we're doing a pretty good job overall of

AI Agents Guardrails And New Careers

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 35:37

of keeping up with it.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 35:37

Yeah, and it's interesting because there's an economy that's happening where there's a whole new career of indiv that's gonna be that's being established of individuals who actually know how to manage agents, these agentic agents and being able to to know, be dangerous enough to know when they're going off the rails and bringing them back because they're they're agents. It's a computer program and making sure that they're actually behaving, acting well within it's really interesting because you can't really guardrail an algorithm, especially if because it gets smarter and smarter. And so I'm wondering if have you seen any guardrails that are being created for for these agents?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 36:21

A lot of it comes back to the restrictions on the way the data is used. So companies will s start off by ring-fencing the data that the agent can have access to. And then there's the idea of human in the loop, although there's a lot of discussion about what that actually means, and you know, can the agent actually can a can a human effectively supervise AI? Some companies will have agents watching other agents. But it it's also interesting that you you mentioned the um the new roles that are being created, because this is also something that came up at our summit last week. Uh I interviewed the chairman of a of a new law firm that's doing everything with AI. And they employ legal engineers, you called them. People who have some legal knowledge, but they can develop an agent that can do a lot of the standard legal work. So I think that's where we're headed.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 37:14

Yeah. And it's interesting, you know, I feel like uh this is a loaded question based on everything we discussed, but for careers, right? So obviously Dow Jones is a news outlet, but as you've talked, I've in my mind thought of like 10 different careers. And so let's start with if someone is interested in journalism, let's just start with journalism. Where should they start? Because it there's a lot, right? So if you I'll be specific. If you want to be a journalist, what what does that look like?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 37:49

I think you well, I would I think business journalism is a great place to be. You know, it's um it's been a growth area. It's whereas a lot of the media has been shrinking over time. Business journalism, particularly business-to-business journalism, it's been a l on a long tr long-term uptrend. And that's that's where I've always focused my efforts. Okay. So that's what I'd recommend. I think having um a broad skill set as well is is beneficial. You know, and increasingly having some AI skills is going to become table stakes, it's gonna be expected. So um there's also there's a common phrase that's going around um you won't lose your job to AI, but you might lose your job to somebody who's got AI skills.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 38:32

Yes.

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 38:33

So going into the workforce, you want to have that up front. And then I think it's something else I always tell people at Dow Jones, people who are new in the company, is try and consume a wide range of business information. Don't don't get stuck in a lane because you'll find that that will benefit you. It will give you context that's going to become increasingly important as we try and understand this complex world.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 38:56

Mm-hmm. Because as you as you said, a lot of companies that may, when you look at industries, before you could silo industries, now they're kind of all coming together.

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 39:06

Yeah.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 39:06

Right? And so you to be a specialist in one industry and not in another, you're probably missing out on something. Uh and I and I always found find that the marketing, marketing folks were kind of the first, in my opinion, to with this AI artificial intelligence stuff because they they're trying to sell to us, right? So they've been using AI for a very long time. Um and so uh but and so okay, so we have the journalism side, business. Now risk risk journalism and doing what you do, risk and compliance. What if someone wanted to be on your team, what does that look like? If someone wants to work in your team, how could they do that?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 39:46

So typically we hire from people who've done something related previously. So somebody who's written about the covered the Justice Department maybe, or they've written about trade issues. And we want we also want people who can try and see their coverage through the eyes of the audience that they're serving. It's not it's not for all. It's um it's it's written to be useful information. So that's that's the slant we would put on it.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 40:15

Oh, nice. I like that. Um and so as we're rounding out our conversation, um what what keeps you doing what you do?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 40:25

It's it's always changing, it's always interesting. I can I can learn new things on a daily basis. I get to mix with a lot of smart, interesting people. Um and so um, you know, I can't I can't say more than that. It's a it's a great role to have.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 40:40

And so it's always it's always changing. So if you want a role that's always changing, this is a great place to be.

Lightning Round And Closing

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 40:46

Uh so before you go, we're gonna give you some lightning round, quick hit hit questions. And every guest tries to say uh neither or adjusts the response. It's not allowed, folks. Okay. So, and I'm not gonna give you a long time to speak to think about it. So I'm gonna go through this. I'm gonna give you two choices and you pick one. Okay, you can't say add a choice, okay? Those are the ground rules. Okay. Breaking news or long form feature.

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 41:18

Breaking news.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 41:19

Breaking news, okay. Live TV or written column?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 41:22

Definitely written column.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 41:24

Oh, okay. Anchor desk or sideline reporter?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 41:27

Sideline reporter, that's where the interesting information is.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 41:30

It is, yeah. I feel like, okay. Um soccer match under the lights or Sunday morning kick-off.

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 41:37

Soccer match, the atmosphere can be incredible.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 41:40

Okay. Um Premier League or World Cup? World Cup.

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 41:44

It's it's a big festival. It's always fun.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 41:46

Okay. Halftime analysis or post-game interview.

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 41:51

Post-game interview. Probably don't have it. I don't consume a lot of sports information. So if I am going to, it would be that.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 41:56

It would be that. Okay. Notebook and pen or phone notes.

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 42:01

Uh I'm mostly digital, but I still take written notes. Yes. The problem I have is understanding them afterwards.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 42:08

I don't know. There are so many devices. Like I've tried everything, and you just build up these notebooks, it's like you try to scan it's a mess. Okay. Documentary series or nightly news?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 42:18

Documentary series, definitely.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 42:19

Okay. Messi or Mbappe?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 42:23

Mbappe because I'm still nursing a grievance against Argentina for the 1986 World Cup quarterfinals when not Messi but another player touched the ball and England lost the game.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 42:37

Okay. Okay. All right. One perfect headline or one perfect on-air sign-off?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 42:46

So I'm a big fan of UK tabloid headlines. Some of them are so clever in very few words they convey something. So the one I the one I'm going to mention is Mexit. This is when Megan Merkel gave up her official duties. So it's Megan and Brexit Mexit. Very clever.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 43:07

Well, thank you so much, Nick. It's been a pleasure. Now, um, where can people find you and what you're doing if they want more information about where should they go?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 43:17

Uh follow me on LinkedIn. So uh Nick or Nicholas Elliott, Dow Jones, you should find me that way.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 43:23

Okay, great. And for the business leaders that are watching, how can they reach out to you, get some more information on the services that you um offer?

Nick Elliott (WSJ) 43:30

Yeah, again, connect with me on LinkedIn. I'm on there every day. So if there's anything you want to know, just message me there.

Dr. Nikisha D. Alcindor 43:36

Okay, great. And so thank you so much. This rounds out another episode. We're so thankful to have you here. And then go ahead, like and subscribe, and we look forward to seeing you on our next episode.